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MacOS 8.6 vs 9.1 vs 9.2.2
Posted by: Phipli on 2023-09-19 09:17:20
If I have a 9.2.2 iso to pull drivers/software from, would I have any need to also keep, say, a 9.1 iso? Or put another way, does the 9.1 iso have anything I might want that the 9.2.1 or 9.2.2 isos don't have?
There are stand alone installers as I linked previously - use them rather than grabbing individual files.
Posted by: Phipli on 2023-09-19 09:28:56
There are stand alone installers as I linked previously - use them rather than grabbing individual files.
Oops, sorry, I posted the links in another thread. Here they are.

USB Adapter Card Support 1.4.6 - Macintosh Garden

kmos9: USB PCI card under Mac OS 9.2.2 by Joerg Weise London, UK Q: I have installed a USB PCI card in my beige PowerMac G3 (or any other Power Macintosh computer without built-in USB ports) running Mac OS 9.2.2, but the card is not working / not recognized by the system. What can I do?
macintoshgarden.org macintoshgarden.org

Posted by: Phipli on 2023-09-19 09:31:05
Also...
Posted by: cobalt60 on 2023-09-20 02:00:20
https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/opengl-1x
https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/gamesprockets-175
Thanks for those

With an 8.6 install, is there nothing that I would want to pull from 9.1 or 9.2.x CDs? With my ZuluSCSI, I was thinking of keeping an OS 9.x ISO on it for convenience if there's anything there I'd ever want, since I get 6 SCSI IDs. But if there's nothing on those I'd want, then I wouldn't do that. If there are things on there that I might want, which OS 9 version ISO would be best?
Posted by: Phipli on 2023-09-20 02:12:15
Thanks for those

With an 8.6 install, is there nothing that I would want to pull from 9.1 or 9.2.x CDs? With my ZuluSCSI, I was thinking of keeping an OS 9.x ISO on it for convenience if there's anything there I'd ever want, since I get 6 SCSI IDs. But if there's nothing on those I'd want, then I wouldn't do that. If there are things on there that I might want, which OS 9 version ISO would be best?
Just install a copy on a second disk or on a partition. 90s macs are really easy to dual and more boot. You can boot from any SCSI disk, and you can partition a disk as many times as makes sense and boot from any partition. Absolutely no difficulties. Partitioning needs the drive wiping (usually), but other than that inconvenience, is a 5 minute job in Drive Setup (made easier with the cracked version that doesn't need an Apple disk).

I feel sometimes people overlook that you only really have to pick which OS version you use, not which you have installed. A few partitions or disks and you can have 7.5.3, 7.6.1, 8.1, 8.6 and 9.1 all installed and bootable on your 9500.
Posted by: croissantking on 2023-09-20 05:05:12
9.x is vastly more stable on new world. On old world it... Is a liability.

It doesn't feel like the same OS.
This makes sense since I have a clamshell iBook with 9.2.2 and it is very, very stable. Not that my beige G3 is so bad, or anything, but it's not quite the same.
Posted by: croissantking on 2023-09-20 05:11:53
Because it is unstable?

Do you like spotty tablecloths? The last person I heard talk like this did.
This made me LOL. (Sorry.)
Posted by: LaPorta on 2023-09-20 05:12:04
As I’d said before, not sure what the Hangup is as 9.1 runs perfectly blazing on my PT Pro with G3 card. That’s an old world machine. It is running an ATA PCI card with ATA to SD adapter. I wonder what the issue you are having is related to.
Posted by: demik on 2023-09-20 05:21:30
Not sure if it's just me but anyway.

I usually run 8.9 or pre-G3 PPCs like yours. 9.1 is indeed kinda of a dog. What I've found however if that if you force 9.2.2 to be installed on theses, speed is close to what it was with 8.6
Posted by: cobalt60 on 2023-09-20 06:01:08
Just install a copy on a second disk or on a partition. 90s macs are really easy to dual and more boot.
I do not want to dual boot Mac versions on this computer. If I need to run a different Mac version, I will simply run it on a different Mac.


You can boot from any SCSI disk
I am using a single SD card via ZuluSCSI, which can contain 6 virtual drives, presented as individual SCSI drives, each with a unique SCSI ID. I have heard of people pulling software from OS 9.x to be used in 8.6. What I want to do is just have one of those virtual drives be an OS 9.x ISO. If there is software I would want from an OS 9.x ISO, I don't know if I'd want an OS 9.1, 9.2.1, and/or 9.2.2 ISO
Posted by: Phipli on 2023-09-20 06:06:37
I do not want to dual boot Mac versions on this computer. If I need to run a different Mac version, I will simply run it on a different Mac.
How come? It's... normal to do so. Back in the day we multi booted. It's not like windows, the installs are completely independent and you just switch which you boot from with the Startup Disk control panel, it's trivial. I mean, you don't have to, but I don't see a reason against it.

I'm quite intrigued.
Posted by: cobalt60 on 2023-09-20 08:26:01
How come?
I don't see a reason for it. If I'm going to multi boot, I would do significantly different OSes, like Linux, NetBSD, and OS X. Dual booting 2 slightly different versions of MacOS has no appeal to me. If for example I go 8.6 on this Mac, and I really wanna run 9.1, I would just do it on one of my Blue G3s.

What I've found however if that if you force 9.2.2 to be installed on theses, speed is close to what it was with 8.6
interesting, I might try that. What about bugginess and crashing?

not sure what the Hangup is as 9.1 runs perfectly blazing on my PT Pro with G3 card.
I am not sure either. It seems to have a periodic freeze, say every 10 seconds for example. Just using the file manager seems very sluggish. What G3 card do you have? I have a Sonnet, which unfortunately I haven't figured out a way to disable speculative execution on this one, which I think could help. Maybe I could throw my 450MHz in which does allow me to disable speculative execution and see if that helps. Also, all my RAM slots are filled and inter-leaved, which I believe is often not recommended with G3 upgrades. Lastly, there's a lot more going on I think with the ZULU SCSI compared to your SD to ATA adapter, so perhaps there's an issue there.
Posted by: Phipli on 2023-09-20 08:32:25
I have a Sonnet, which unfortunately I haven't figured out a way to disable speculative execution on this one, which I think could help.
You don't have to use the Sonnet drivers. Remove them, install PowerLogix CPU Director and use that to turn off Speculative addressing.

I use CPU Director with my Sonnet.
Posted by: LaPorta on 2023-09-20 08:36:35
I am not sure either. It seems to have a periodic freeze, say every 10 seconds for example. Just using the file manager seems very sluggish. What G3 card do you have? I have a Sonnet, which unfortunately I haven't figured out a way to disable speculative execution on this one, which I think could help. Maybe I could throw my 450MHz in which does allow me to disable speculative execution and see if that helps. Also, all my RAM slots are filled and inter-leaved, which I believe is often not recommended with G3 upgrades. Lastly, there's a lot more going on I think with the ZULU SCSI compared to your SD to ATA adapter, so perhaps there's an issue there.

I have a NewerTech 400 MHz model, not sure how they differ. All my RAM slots are filled to >512 MB. You may be onto something with the Zulu SCSI. I tried to get a SCSI2SD v6 to work in there, and I never got it to function reliably. Weird file corruption, slowness, etc…never could pin it down. This is with having 4-5 other SCSI2SDs working fine in other Macs…this one just was not having it. Next I tried ATA to CF, and the CF card would take forever to read/write, especially in 9, so shutting down would take 2 minutes, games would take long to load, etc. perhaps try using a real HD and see if the issues go away (this was how I ruled out my problem).
Posted by: cobalt60 on 2023-09-20 08:51:16
You don't have to use the Sonnet drivers. Remove them, install PowerLogix CPU Director and use that to turn off Speculative addressing.
Oh awesome. CPU Director wouldn't allow me to boot when i had a Sonnet G4 on my carrier card, so I stopped using it. But I have since replaced the G4 with a faster G3, so will give it a try again. I really like CPU Director so that makes me very happy to know it can work with the Sonnet.
Posted by: cobalt60 on 2023-09-22 20:20:13
Well I got 9.1 running pretty nicely. Can't say for sure what did it. I used CPU Director to enable backside cache (I didn't have backside cache enabled every time I tried 9.1 previously, which may have soured my opinion), set to 2:1, and disable speculative execution. In the memory control panel I set my disk cache to 16MB (probably overkill) and disabled VM. On the ZuluSCSI, I disabled parity checking (probably OT but any known downsides to enabling this?).

I will note that launching SpeedMeter locked up the system, but I think this would have happened on 8.6 as well. Seems to be an incompatibility with the Sonnet CPU I think.

I think I will consider this my stable install for now, but do plan on trying 9.2.2 soon.
Posted by: volvo242gt on 2023-09-22 22:25:30
9.2.2 should be fine. You'll need to use OS9Helper, of course. I ran 9.2.2 on a 7500/100 that had been upgraded to a 200MHz 604e, then, later in my use, a NewerTech G3/300. Was required by a chat program I used at the time (the old MSN Messenger app). I eventually switched to a 9600, but moved both the hard drive and the G3 processor card over to that computer. Continued to work as it did in the 7500.

*edit* That same 9.2.2 install is currently in use on my G4 Digital Audio.
Posted by: croissantking on 2023-09-23 01:12:54
In the memory control panel I set my disk cache to 16MB
I swear this setting tops out at ~8MB
Posted by: cobalt60 on 2023-09-23 01:26:03
I swear this setting tops out at ~8MB
May change depending on installed RAM. Let's me go up to 32MB, and I have 320MB RAM
Posted by: croissantking on 2023-09-23 01:42:38
May change depending on installed RAM. Let's me go up to 32MB, and I have 320MB RAM
Just tested this on my clamshell iBook - this machine runs OS 9.2.2 and has 544MB installed. You’re right, the disk cache goes up to 32736K (not 32768K). On newer Macs, I’ve always just left it on the automatic setting and never thought to try increasing it above that. I think older Macs do top out at around 7 or 8MB though.

16MB definitely would be overkill for you, I would have thought.
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