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ADTPro help
Posted by: olePigeon on 2011-01-11 15:57:48
I successfully got my IIe card to bootstrap from my IIci using the old version of Mac ADT. Unfortunately it just dies when it attempts to verify the disk format.

So I bought a USB to Serial adapter off eBay. It didn't come with any software nor indicate who made it, but after some searching, I found out it was a Prolific USB to Serial adapter. Installed the 10.6 drivers and OS X saw it right away.

Unfortunately when I attempt to bootstrap my IIe card, nothing happens. I tell ADTPro to send the ProDOS client, and nothing happens on the IIe side after I set it to listen for the client.

Is there a way I can test if any data at all is being sent through the serial cable?
Posted by: david__schmidt on 2011-01-11 19:19:27
I successfully got my IIe card to bootstrap from my IIci using the old version of Mac ADT. Unfortunately it just dies when it attempts to verify the disk format.
That was a message it used to give when the disk it was trying to read was unformatted. Can you INIT the disk first?

So I bought a USB to Serial adapter off eBay. [...] I found out it was a Prolific USB to Serial adapter.
OSX users have had a spotty history with Prolific drivers. Hopefully they've improved. You can see some of the stories in the ADTPro forum:

http://sourceforge.net/apps/phpbb/adtpro/index.php

Unfortunately when I attempt to bootstrap my IIe card, nothing happens. I tell ADTPro to send the ProDOS client, and nothing happens on the IIe side after I set it to listen for the client.
I'm missing some pieces of the story line, I think. You used MacADT to communicate between your LC and IIci machine with a printer cable (null modem). Then, you changed to a Prolific-based, USB-to-DE9 serial adapter. What does the cabling look like now? Is it a null modem too? Do you have the pinout?
Posted by: olePigeon on 2011-01-11 20:32:41
Sorry, two different incidents.

My first attempt was with a Mac IIci connected to my IIe card using an Apple printer cable (serial cable.) The worked fine up until it tried to verify the disk image, upon which it went kaput.

My second attempt was with my MacBook Pro using a Prolific USB to Serial adapter and a DB-9 to mini-DIn 8 cable. I bought two cables from the electronics recycler. One actually has the Apple logo on it, the other looks identical to this:



I downloaded my Prolific drivers from here:

http://www.prolific.com.tw/eng/downloads.asp?id=31
Posted by: david__schmidt on 2011-01-12 04:51:57
Sorry, two different incidents.
Ok, and I believe they're unrelated to each other.

My first attempt was with a Mac IIci connected to my IIe card using an Apple printer cable (serial cable.) The worked fine up until it tried to verify the disk image, upon which it went kaput.
Note that an Apple printer cable is in fact a null modem: the transmit and receive lines are crossed. That's as opposed to a modem cable, which would have tx-tx and rx-rx. When connecting to an IIe card, you need a null modem cable. And that's most likely the cause of the problem below.

My second attempt was with my MacBook Pro using a Prolific USB to Serial adapter and a DB-9 to mini-DIn 8 cable. I bought two cables from the electronics recycler.
Unless/until you really know the pinout, the external appearance (besides the physical connectors, anyway) is not relevant. If you have a voltmeter that can measure resistance, you can check which pins are connected to which other pins. It needs to be fairly close to this arrangement:

   Apple 
MiniDIN8  DE-9  DB-25  RS-232
   Pin#  Pin#   Pin#    Name
--------  ----  -----  ------
   5 ----- 3      2     TxD
   3 ----- 2      3     RxD
   4 --,-- 5      7     GND
   8 --'
   1 ----- 8      5     CTS
   2 --+-- 7      4     RTS
       '-- 4     20     DTR
   7 ----- 1      8     DCD
http://adtpro.sourceforge.net/connectionsserial.html#MiniDIN8

The wrong pinout is the root of the problem 99% of the time.

I downloaded my Prolific drivers from here:

http://www.prolific.com.tw/eng/downloads.asp?id=31
That's fine. Chances are it'll work with the right cable. The problem OSX has with Prolific chipsets is that they'll work for a while, but then will flake out in the middle of a transfer.
Posted by: olePigeon on 2011-01-12 09:40:50
Just so happens I bought a multimeter last year to test PRAM batteries. I'll check the pins, thanks.
Posted by: olePigeon on 2011-01-12 18:00:00
OK, I tested the wires and they were absolutely nothing like what I need, so you were right about the wiring.

However, I'm a little confused about the diagram. Does it say both 4 & 8 from the miniDIN8 go to pin 5 on the DE-9? And that pins 7 & 4 from the DE-9 both go to pin 2 on the miniDIN8?
Posted by: david__schmidt on 2011-01-12 18:45:28
OK, I tested the wires and they were absolutely nothing like what I need, so you were right about the wiring.
Excellent. Problem identified.

However, I'm a little confused about the diagram. Does it say both 4 & 8 from the miniDIN8 go to pin 5 on the DE-9? And that pins 7 & 4 from the DE-9 both go to pin 2 on the miniDIN8?
Yes, that's exactly it. You can make all the connections at one side or the other, of course. Just make the connections together wherever it's convenient.
Posted by: olePigeon on 2011-01-13 18:04:14
Well, I probably wired it wrong, but I managed to get it to send gibberish. So that's a start. 😀

Posted by: olePigeon on 2011-02-17 16:07:13
So I finally got my hands on a Keyspan 9pin serial adapter. Hooked it up to my IIe card.

It seems to work. It gets all the way to the end, then craps out with this:

BF02- A=01 X01 Y=05 P=34 S=EC

*

Any ideas?
Posted by: david__schmidt on 2011-02-17 16:57:48
It seems to work. It gets all the way to the end, ...
When you are starting the bootstrapping process, you can't start by sending just ADT... you have to have a copy of DOS running underneath it first.

If you want to run DOS and ADT, then: bootstrap DOS, then send the ADT client.

If you want to run ProDOS and ADTPro, then: bootstrap ProDOS, then send the ADTPro client.
Posted by: olePigeon on 2011-02-17 19:19:26
Derp. Thanks. 🙂

I got it to boot! 😀

Now I just need to get it to detect the host. I'm using an Apple serial cable from an Imagewriter. I'm going to attempt it again with the IIc Imagewriter option, see if that does the trick.

I tried my 5.25" drive with the read/write toggle that I installed, but it didn't work. 😛 I'll have to play with it some more. Hopefully I'll get the bugs worked out on that, too.
Posted by: olePigeon on 2011-02-17 19:36:46
Gah. Can't get it to talk to the server after it's bootstrapped. I must be missing a step. Sorry for all these stupid questions.
Posted by: david__schmidt on 2011-02-17 19:49:39
Not all null modem cables are created equal. When it'll send but not communicate bi-directionally, suspect the cable. Also: make sure you change the speed settings on both ends to be 19200 baud once everything is up and running. See:

http://adtpro.sourceforge.net/lc.html
Posted by: olePigeon on 2011-02-17 20:04:21
Yep, they're both 19.2.

However, now that I have a working serial adapter, I can just go to the surplus store and buy me a new cable. They have boxes of them. I'll grab a few and try them out.

Thanks for the help.
Posted by: olePigeon on 2011-02-17 20:42:33
Found a different serial cable. Now I don't know if it was the cable, but I did notice that in the Config menu the baud rate was incorrect. After setting the baud to 19200... IT WORKED!

I wrote ADTPro to floppy. 😀

Posted by: olePigeon on 2011-02-17 20:53:20
Woowoo! Just made a backup copy of my Ultima III disk. 😀

Now I have a pristine copy with no saved characters on it. Maybe I'll upload it to the Asimov archive. 🙂

All I have to do is fix the read/write switch and I can make duplicates of my Ultima disks. I remade the labels in Adobe Illustrator. This is gonna be fun. :lol:

Posted by: Cosmo on 2012-09-05 21:55:03
It's an old topic but assume it's better to keep one thread line instead of making another...

Apple //c (ROM 0) trying to bootstrap with Image Writer Cable. Am i doing it wrong?

At Apple //c end i put the cable in MODEM port, another end goes to PC (running Linux) printer port (LPT).

Have the software running at Linux fine, connecting - i use [x] use image writer-cable setting, i send the ProDos client serial

and Apple //c i boot with ProDos and use the commands as instructed:

IN#2

ctrl+A

14B

I get the question mark "?" fine but then, nothing. It's listening, but nothing happening.
Posted by: mcdermd on 2012-09-05 23:03:49
I know baud rate settings needed to be adjusted when I connected my IIc and /// to my modern Macs.
Posted by: Cosmo on 2012-09-05 23:17:35
Need to indeed try that. Do you remember what value you used?

I found out i have the connector-cable for the Apple ][ - Super Serial Card also, so i can have THREE Super Serial Cards on ][e (just for the fun of it).
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